The Tolkien Estate policy from their website….this is what I mean when I say modern copyright law is a disease that only protects mega corporations and discourages creativity and engaging with the works you love in any meaningful way haha
I Love how the major theme of lotr is that stories are like language, growing and changing with the culture that created them as new storytellers take over…….and yet currently the estate seems to have contempt for any “storyteller” who isn’t a massive faceless corporation.
The estate aren’t even Tolkien’s children anymore??? I find it VERY hard to believe they genuinely care about protecting the sanctity of whatever whatever, and even if they did it’d still be nonsense.
Taking an official stance against people using Tolkien’s languages for any use “commercial or otherwise,” and condemning anyone for making derivative works…..agh. I sorta knew this would happen but I still hurts.
I love for lord of the rings to be frozen in the state that it existed decades ago, legally unable to grow or change . I love for lord of the rings to be shackled to the bigotry of its author even though its author has been dead for like 50 years. I love for a story supposedly about the way legends and language evolve to be legally prevented from evolving .
And I can’t wait until their books are finally public domain in 20 years, as they should be already. Unless of course Amazon does what Disney did and gets the government to change copyright law so the books never enter the public domain.
I doubt the Tolkien estate will be like Anne rice and angrily send takedown notices for fanfic, it’s just really disheartening to see how much contempt they have for anyone who isn’t a corporation.
Agh, I hate to live in a world where all our stories can only be “owned” by faceless media conglomerates that mistreat their workers in order to farm out bland generic content….it really sucks
A month ago when we first saw that the Elves have short hair in the new show I was like “ew not wtf this is an abomination” but then I cut my own hella long elven hair off irl and now look like Amazon Elrond and am nowlike
And am now accidentally all for the short hair elf thing
Is anyone else really angry that Amazon has the rights to LOTR?
Content warning: mentions of genocide, slavery, and sexual assault.
A lot of people have expressed concerns that Amazon’s LOTR TV show will be bad, which I understand, but this is about something else which I haven’t seen any discussion of online. The show could be good—although I doubt it will be—and I will still be angry that Amazon is making it.
Amazon profits from the forced labor of Uighurs in China and has ties to a Chinese company that is directly involved in the Chinese Government’s ongoing genocide against the Uighur people (ASPI,LA Times).
Amazon treats its employees like slaves, forcing them to work in unsafe conditions, paying them poverty wages, preventing them from unionizing, and surveilling them around the clock (The Guardian,New York Times).
Amazon has supplied facial recognition technology to US law enforcement and helps ICE and the Department of Homeland Security track and lock up immigrants (ACLU, The Guardian).
Amazon has a huge carbon footprint that has been growing every year, along with the waste it generates, even as Amazon tries to portray itself as environmentally friendly (AP News,CNBC,Forbes).
Amazon has paid a fraction of the taxes that it should have paid over the past ten years, allowing it to become even richer and more powerful (The Guardian).
Amazon has done so many terrible things that it would take me too long to list them all.
Online discussions about the LOTR show, from what I have seen, have focused on whether or not it will be good, whether or not it will follow canon, whether or not it will have a diverse cast, and to some degree, concerns that it will be like Game of Thrones, with tasteless sex scenes and gratuitous violence. I understand why many Tolkien fans care about these things, and I do, too. We want the source material portrayed respectfully; we want a diverse cast; we don’t want an adaptation of Tolkien that feels like Game of Thrones. But since Amazon is making it, I think focusing on these issues risks losing sight of the bigger picture.
Even if the show is diverse—as many fans have been hoping—Amazon is still harming people of color in real life. Even if the show has beautiful visuals—and it probably will, since it’s being filmed in New Zealand—Amazon is still destroying the earth. Even if the show respects fans’ wishes and refrains from gratuitous sex scenes, Amazon is still helping the US Government lock up immigrants, many of whom are sexually assaulted by guards while in custody (Texas Tribune,New York Times).Even if the show follows LOTR canon, Amazon represents things that Tolkien and his heroes fundamentally opposed: cruelty, violence, destruction, and the acquisition of power to dominate and control others.
When the show comes out, there will be articles about whether it follows canon; articles about how fans are reacting to it; articles making predictions about the plot. There will be controversy about this or that writing choice. Some people will be upset that it’s not diverse enough; racists will be upset that there’s any diversity at all. People will talk about what they liked about the show and what could have been done better. And Amazon wants this. Because these headlines—even if negative—will distract from everything else Amazon is doing.
Amazon wants to use the popularity of LOTR—the nostalgia of it, the comfort of it, the fact that so many people all over the world love Middle-earth—not just to make money, but to make you forget what Amazon is. Don’t we all want to let our imaginations take us back to Middle-earth, just for a little while, and forget about the real world’s problems? Amazon’s LOTR show will let you do that. And no doubt some people reading this are already thinking, “Why can’t you let people enjoy things?” Amazon is counting on you feeling that way. But real life is more important than fiction.
If you understand why the peoples of Middle-earth resisted Sauron, you should see that Amazon is the Sauron of our world: it enslaves, exploits, and dominates vulnerable people, it increases the power of the surveillance state, and it destroys nature, all with the goal of amassing even more power so it can destroy, control, and enslave. That may sound melodramatic, but Amazon invited the comparison by doing what it does. In fact, I find it absurd that Amazon has the rights to LOTR at all, when it is so obviously the villain of the story it is now adapting.
Amazon profits from genocide and slavery and the destruction of the environment, and I find it grotesque that this company now wants to profit off of Tolkien’s works, when he would have abhorred Amazon and everything that it stands for, and when the values at the heart of LOTR are diametrically opposed to everything Amazon does. I am furious that this company, with all the blood on its hands, is allowed to touch the works of my favorite author. And I am furious that Amazon is going to use LOTR as a shield from all the negative press it deserves for all of the issues that I listed above, and more.
It doesn’t matter if the LOTR show is “good” or “bad” because Amazon is evil. If you want to enjoy things, then reread the books or rewatch the movies. I will not give Amazon a single penny for their LOTR show and I hope you won’t either. I don’t know if boycotting it will make a difference—I just know that I hate Amazon and they don’t deserve the money or press they may get from LOTR. So we shouldn’t give it to them.
I posted this on July 27, shortly before Amazon released their promotional picture on August 2, and it’s been frustrating how the online conversation since then has been exactly what I predicted.
There have been breathless news headlines like “Finally, We Have a First Image From Amazon’s Lord of the Rings Series” and “Lord of the Rings fans react to ‘gorgeous’ first-look image of new Amazon TV adaptation”. There have been an annoying number of articles “explaining” what’s in the promotional image and what it means for the content of the show—and these articles always imply that LOTR fans are unanimously excited to watch it, and that fans will be even happier if Amazon delves into The Silmarillion or Unfinished Tales or parts of The History of Middle-earth.
Meanwhile, from what I have seen, fan conversations and posts about the show have mostly consisted of: 1) People saying how excited they are to watch it or posting memes about how excited they are to watch it. 2) People speculating about the plot and timeline, including what they want to see and don’t want to see. 3) People upset about Amazon’s decision to move filming from New Zealand to the UK.
I wish Tolkien fans wouldn’t buy into this. I’ve seen so many posts saying “I can’t wait to see [place]” or “I hope it will include [character]” or “I just want it to be good” and you know what? It honestly stuns me that any fan of Tolkien’s works would be happy or excited about this show. Where are your feelings of outrage? Amazon is responsible for a myriad of unforgivable things, and the fact that they want to create a TV show set in Middle-earth does not change that. The fact that Amazon has any rights to LOTR is an insult to Tolkien’s name. We should be calling for a boycott, not lapping up the next mediocre entertainment they try to sell us, not even “hoping” that it will be “good”.
And fans who are upset about filming being moved to the UK are also missing the point. Because within every expression of disappointment lies the assumption that if only Amazon were to continue filming in New Zealand, then everything would be fine.
All this hype about the LOTR TV show is a distraction. It’s good business for Amazon, even when they’re not directly making money, because it’s good press. Amazon has been under fire all year (not to mention last year) for preventing employees from unionizing, among other things. Amazon’s huge budget for the LOTR series—$1 billion dollars over five seasons—is only possible because of the degree to which they exploit their workers and avoid paying taxes. And that gigantic sum of money—as little a portion as it is, admittedly, of the entirety of the company’s wealth—looks even more grotesque when you remember the poverty in which many Amazon employees live.
Amazon would much rather you associate their name with something fun, like speculation over the plot of their TV show, than any of their crimes and abuses. So think about that next time you see the promotional image, or whatever Amazon releases next.
I also want to add that Amazon refused to pay medical bills for stuntpeople injured during the filming of this show, so even with regard to this production we already have labor rights violations and worker exploitation.
God, this puts everything I feel about this show into words. At this point I feel like Gale sitting alone in a field and refusing to watch the hunger games. Where is the outrage?
Babes, for shits and giggles, I want to hear your cringiest predictions for the Amazon LOTR show-
I’m talking terrible Twitter hot-takes, buzzfeed personality quizzes, complete disregard for the source material, terrible memes, WHATEVER YOU THINK (or fear) WILL HAPPEN I WANT TO HEAR IT (and maybe draw it, Yknow to cope)
I think at this point my current attitude with regard to the Amazon series is this:
•watchful waiting. We’ll see what this Super Bowl trailer reveals.
• thinking of it as Tolkien-esque or Tolkien-adjacent rather than Tolkien based.
•also thinking of it as fanfic by someone who wants to jump right in to the middle of canon events but isn’t super attached to the actual canon or timeline and really likes to create OCs. And who basically noped on Hugo Weaving’s Elrond.
•at least we may get Howard Shore music, if rumors are accurate.
•my ideas can remain my own and that my headcanons may actually feel more valid after this. And that is a comforting thought.
Yes, the new promotional photos are awful (Dwarves without beards? Elves with short hair? 52-year-old Celebrimbor?), but let’s not forget the real reason to hate this show: it’s made by Amazon, which is literally the antithesis of everything LOTR is about. Let’s get this trending on Twitter:
I swear to all things holy if Amazon cast Timothy Chapstick or Henry Clavicle as one of the Elf’s or something for the Lotr show they’re making …. I’m gonna blow a fuse
i love seeing the amazon lotr discourse as someone who hasnt read the silmarillion. someone will be like “and in this article theyre saying Folfingariel was in Bimbol’bur during the rise of the 2nd age yet in the text Tolkien *clearly* states that he was busy crafting the bracers of Finglehelm up until the fall of Dghsdjkfgheim ”. and im just here like. wow i cant believe they would say hes in bimblebur….
I’m considering becoming a rabid defender of The Show not because I think it’ll be good, but because there are so many posts trying to guilt trip me into hating it
will it be good? unlikely. will it match our entrenched fanon? I doubt it. is amazon ethical? of course not. do you get to tell me how to feel about any of this? no!!
Yes. This. Don’t demand I have a certain emotional reaction to anything, much less a stupid streaming show! Demanding everyone feel exactly as you do and if not they’re eeeeeevil is so manipulative and has zero effect on the things you say you’re upset about. Although it’s a great way to virtue signal!
God. I might not even watch more than one episode - I never watched battle of five armies after all. And yet just saying ‘let’s see what happens’ means I’m a rabid Show fan apparently.
It probably helps to view it like the stages of grief. Part of the fandom is currently going through Anger (hence the venting) or just moving into Bargaining (hence the attempts to convince others). It will take some time until Acceptance is reached…
You know, the way you imagine a character’s appearance is directly related to how you interpret their personality.
From what we’ve read of Celebrimbor I think he was good-hearted, had a strong moral backbone, had a strong will, was hardworking, strong, brave, selfless, had a desire for knowledge & a desire for building, he was full of ideas, hopes, dreams & plans, he was open to everyone and was eager to make bridges & friendships, he was deeply lonely and alone & sad & he was determined to make up for the wrongdoings of his family & restore their name.
& I know it would underestimate Sauron’s deception skills but compared to the ‘the wise’ (Gil-Galad, Elrond & Galadriel) Celebrimbor looked rather naive.
So all the reasons listed above, make me imagine Celebrimbor as a very young man. (Other than the fact that elves don’t look old. But even among the elves some like Elrond at the end of the third age look “neither old nor young”. But I think Celebrimbor straight-up looked young. Like he was in his twenties.)
And you know, a youth full of hopes & dreams & plans & ideas, fighting alone & dying horribly under torture because he trusted and welcomed someone and because he was eager to learn & to build is a real tragedy.
That the Amazon series now can’t show.
Idk what they’re going to do with the character but as I said, how you imagine him to look is related to how you imagine him to be.
And how vastly different we imagined Celebrimbor to look, makes me think how vastly different we imagine his character is. So far, the only word the showrunners have used to describe him has been “mysterious”. Which is not at all what I’d use in a million years to describe Celebrimbor. What about him is mysterious?
And with “politically ambitious” Elrond & “brash” Galadriel…Idk I worry how they’re going to write him.
Apparently a trailer for the new LoTR show came out. I haven’t watched it nor do I plan on watching the show itself, but I’m not gonna post hate about it so much anymore now that it’s here. It was one thing when it was just a project and could have been canceled before it began, but now it’s final and there are real people involved and everything (actors, costumers, set designers, etc.) so I’m gonna reel it back a bit.
Look Amazon Prime, I did a thing and it wasn’t even that hard, sometimes giving original characters some familiar features is kind of good, ok? I know I know…. elves looking like fans expect them to look is sooooo weird and unheard of…but maybe…try?
ALT
