Honestly, if I had doubts about Misha’s statement being a lie, this shipper would make the doubts disappeareasily because of her “logical” way of thinking.
Jared saying again he straight, never hinted in the past he gay, got very common homophobic gay jokes, never rumored being with man, never touched/flirted with men except using Jensen ignoring him being uncomfortable = don’t believe him when he saying he straight.
Misha saying he is straight basically backtracks after coming out that this is a very common behavior, we know he had threesomes with men, talking about the past as sleeping/dating individuals (not specific women), and got a poem about man = believe him when he says he is straight.
The screenshot:
[@ this hat:]
I won’t go into specifics about Misha except to say - you are absolutely and completely wrong. Misha did not ‘queerbait’ his fans - that’s not even possible, how the fuck would a real person queerbait people? he is a REAL PERSON. If you assumed he was bi, then that’s kind of on you? Because he never said anything one way or another - and he did not HAVE TO DO SO, either. Because that’s nobody’s business but his and whomstever he might be fucking.
Let’s not forget that when he joined SPN, literally it was STILL ILLEGAL FOR GAY PEOPLE TO GET MARRIED IN MOST STATES IN THE US. “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” was in effect for the military.
And don’t even get me started about crying for rep back in those days, jaysus - 2005 would have given you plenty to weep about, believe me.
So yeah, keep in mind that that’s the atmosphere he was working in, that’s what it was like here, back then. And it was just as bad, if not worse, in a lot of ways, in media and entertainment. Even at that point, it was still considered pretty risky for any actor of any caliber to come out as queer. I mean jfc - before the whole scandal with Kevin Spacey, I had him clocked from fifty million miles away (he took his MOM to the Oscars with him and was never seen out with any serious lady-friend type dates) - people knew, for sure, but nobody said jack. WHY? Because it just wasn’t done.
Also - don’t make me laugh with the whole 'HW idiocy’ conspiracy horseshit. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar and a homophobic wanker is just a homophobic wanker. When people show you who they are, believe them, etc. etc. He might very well be closeted himself, but if he is, he’s a self-loathing biohazard of a person.
if i ever needed evidence of the decay of ethics in the cockles fandom, current events are it.
There was the old cockles fandom and its ethics. There were the old names in it. The people who found important information years ago. one unfortunately passed away and we all miss her. one sort of went moot as the job they do and the location were no longer relevant.
But they found something years ago. found a lot of things. the few people who had it distributed it carefully. most everyone deleted the outright doxxy elements.
But seeing cockles fandom basically try to angle to see if anyone still has that doxxy material from 2017? YIKES. That’s not how this shit operates, kids.
It’s such a bizarre thing because Misha’s even publicly acknowledged it too at this point, several ways, the most obvious of which was blankeygate but the talk over a few years about moving in with a friend in van at cons and M&Gs.
So like, what’s the point? Barring the queer nuances of whether or not anyone believes the straight thing, what’s the objective here? If they were straight, could straight bros not be roommates? like, misha backpedaled and said he was straight so now everyone needs proof that a real thing existed, even though sexuality is not a necessary component, and you’re intentionally seeking out the original doxxy docs that weirded everyone into panic deleting it like 5 years ago, now, because they KNEW it was wrong to have?
Christ.
Fuck.
Stop.
i swear on my life if anyone tries some bullshit like saying bex made it up i’ll rip their throat the fuck out, right here and now, not because cockles, but because bex.
like I rode the line of her chemo through her in DM almost every day, her failing treatments, the fact that it was unresponsive to medication and had metasticized into her everything, that woman was my fucking friend and I miss her often so seeing this shit is setting off a primitive fucking instinct to catch a plane ticket and monkey stomp anyone dragging this shit back up
she’s fucking dead. her fandom achievements that gave her information that made her happy as she fucking DIED, the things people protected for years, is not goddamn fucking fodder for people suddenly questioning shit misha even made semi-public on like 3 different occasions, and definitely not material for self declared intellectuals to sit here thinking they have a box to question my integrity, or to take a sweep at “oh just [one source]?” when there’s a fuckton of people here in this fandom that were there for the initial info drop, because at the end of the day, you’re not questioning my integrity, you’re coming at my dead fucking friend, so I’m gonna get hot and say back the FUCK up.
none of you will ever be bex. none of you. you can fucking pontificate all you want to think you’re outsmarting things based off of serial assumptions, hot takes, personal perceptions, etc, but that doesn’t change reality. It doesn’t change that you are literally pissing off the friends of a dead woman and questioning her moral integrity
oh my god i’m so pissed at allof you.
bonus fucking round for the smoothbrain that posted “stars don’t have utility bills” and the other genius that nodded like Jared’s own bills in Van and Gen being signed on it weren’t made PUBLIC years ago.
difference is, cockes fandom used to have the integrity to not Be Like That. Congrats you’re now Like That
Who the fuck is talking about Bex? She was a beautiful, sweet, nice person, friendly to everyone. No one will ever be like her. NOBODY. Everything she knew she kept to herself or talked to people she trusted. The only things she shared were already publicly acknowledged and free to be shared with others. If there was a person who cared about privacy it was her, not like others who are here only for likes and to make themselves popular.
YUP. That’s it. That’s Bex. Even when Bex landed private information, she dispensed it carefully. Sometimes she even felt bad about things she found out, often by mistake, landed in her lap. She’d fret about it privately even with people she trusted. She wanted to share joy and nothing else, and was always so very careful about how much private info she seeded into things that were public. Bex just about BUILT cockles fandom and its ethics. Her posts still spread to this day.
But now, people who weren’t there when it was first discovered, are trying to implicitly slap at this shit with braindead takes [see: “celebrities don’t have utilities” like jared’s hasn’t been public for years with gen undersigned in his yaletown property] or imply that anyone that talks about it is lying, but realistically, all they’re doing is coming at a goddamn dead woman.
also the “misdelivered mail” is not how it happened. yes, bills were involved. the delivery of mail, or opening of mail, had nothing to do with it, thanks for coming to my ted fucking talk.
yeah bills just magically come in the mail, fully manifested from the aether of the electric fairy demanding payment, and the only way to access that information is via mail I Am Very Intelligent. i am also a good pure human being who has never ever looked up people of curiosity in the systems i work on because i, like you pretending to be incensed reading the idea of it, am a robot with no curiosity.
n o , it was neither me nor bex that searched it.
fuck.
any of us that DIDNT delete the more sensitive information almost FIVE YEARS ago, anyone that has it sure as SHIT is not going to suddenly post it on tumblr FIVE YEARS LATER, or send it in DM to someone publicly chest beating for proof that obviously is just going to spread it all the fuck around. holy shit.
As one of the Cockles old guard, I absolutely agree with this take. It’s been dismaying to watch the tags get overloaded with people acting like Jensen and Misha are the latest K-pop ship or some shit, when they’ve been a thing for a lot of us for nearly as long as Misha has been on the show.
And the reason it has lasted so long to wind up on the freaking top ships list on the hellsite is because we kept this shit ON THE DL. On lockdown.
Like - Jensen and Misha (but mostly Jensen, lbrh) have no chill when they’re around each other and, tbh, even with all the bills and other doxxy nonsense people were getting up to, I honestly bet folding cash money they were living together well before Misha officially ‘moved in’.
ANYway, that’s not the point of this. Point is - I don’t wanna but I’m pretty sure that the tag breaking containment was what caused that mess at NJcon. At least in some part. I’m not blaming ANYONE at the panel or anybody in the M&G post-panel, btw, not at all - but I do think that the hubbub, positive or not, definitely helped to catch the media’s attention.
If you’re (general 'you’) sitting there, feeling entitled or like you can demand stuff from these two guys, then you’re doing it wrong. That’s not how this ship works. We observe. We appreciate. We soak up the serotonin. We do NOT post comments about it in Jensen or Misha’s social media. We do not harass, malign, insult or otherwise act like dicks about the wives, their families, their kids, their in-laws, the lot.
We also do not pester them to try to make stuff happen - know why? Because they know us, and they feed us when they can (often without them even realizing it XD). Also the antis usually wind up manifesting it for us with their ridiculous copypasta bullshit anyhow. lol
If you draw too much attention to something outside of the hellsite, it could look really bad. There’s tons of shit I know and have even forgotten about by now that could be a bad look and it’s not even anything 'bad’. It’s just… Misha has lived a very interesting and colorful life, and his way of existing is just not everybody’s cup of tea. In point of fact, I could see how someone like Misha scares the shit out of the right-wrong kind of people.
Anyway. That’s my two bits on this whole ish. I don’t think there’s a thing wrong with being excited or happy about good news when it happens to someone you stan, but in the case of this particular sailing vessel, loose lips could literally sink us. SO STOP SQUAWKING ON US.
(Russian version of this post for Russian speakers: X)
Just for the record - I’m an ordinary human who can make mistakes. Please don’t think that my words are real truth. This is just my subjective observation.
To begin with, as we all know (our wonderful Cockles fandom), there was something wrong with W*lker’s situation from the first place.
For quite a long time (since the information about Winchesters was leaked), we have observed a very ambiguous situation. As we remember, J*red personally announced that Jensen will direct W*lker. While Jensen himself was in no hurry to officially inform anyone about it. Then a rather strange period of several months began, when J*red and Jensen talked about the “exact” dates of the directing, which wasn’t coming again and again. We don’t take the situation with “Rust”, because it’s a serious and, unfortunately, painful circumstance. Although it also mattered.
Then during the panel there was a conversation about Jensen’s birthday, which was quite far from the date of this con. I wonder why Jensen would do this not in his any free time, since he promised it, but on his birthday? Why does he need such a specific binding to this date? What is it? A hopeless attempt to delay directing until the last possible moment, after which he can no longer find excuses not to do it? A very interesting set of circumstances, I think. Very strange, ambiguous and interesting.
Even if we abstract away from Cockles and look at everything from the point of view of Jensen fans, it still looks strange. When two celebrities come to an agreement on some kind of joint work, they negotiate the terms in advance and back it up with official documents, because nothing works without contracts. No one can just show up on set and say: “I’ll direct it.” This should be backed up by official document, right? Then, based on this whole situation, we can immediately come to the conclusion, which was obvious from the start. That this whole agreement was only in words without specific confirmations and deadlines, because Jensen wasn’t sure that he would do it. He wasn’t sure until the end.
Why? There are several reasons exist, I think.
First of all, Jensen was really busy. And unlike Jared, who likes to make strong empty statements, Jensen always plans what and how to do. And “squeezing” an apparently unsuccessful show between the schedule of more important and serious things wasn’t clearly part of his plans.
Secondly, the agreement was J*red’s pressure instrument from the first place, who knows how to press the right points and turn the situation in his favor.
And thirdly, another no less important detail, did anyone find the moment of pause of W*lker strange? Why would they put filming on hold for quite some time when, as Jared tried to tell us, the show was supposedly fine? What’s wrong? Maybe because just no one needs this show, and there is no expected success from it? In this case, if we summarize it, then this didn’t happen by chance, right? The suspension of filming and a deadline are directly interconnected. Because J*red knew that Jensen would really do nothing until this moment, and filming the second part of season 2 without him could be a complete failure. So, it is quite clear that these are interrelated factors.
But something else is more interesting here. I have always been curious personally, what does Misha think about all this? And what does he relevant for W*lker and the fact that Jensen “owed” Jared for no reason? We don’t have information about all the details, we see only the tip of the iceberg. But Misha knows everything firsthand (from Jensen). This remained a true mystery, which, unfortunately, no one could solve, because Misha didn’t share any emotions on this topic, and no one can read his mind. I had speculations, but they weren’t backed up by any facts to indicate his thoughts on the matter. And I don’t want to throw information without any basis.
But now the last con has happened, during which I finally saw something. Those were the seconds, and my brain exploded after this moment. It didn’t occur to me right away to pay attention to it. When I was watching a video from someone’s phones, I didn’t notice. But while watching the whole JenMish panel, when I had a long recording with the right angle in front of me, my eyes still caught it.
So, that was (who would have thought, yeah?) a question about W*lker. Oh, you all saw this moment, right?
It’s their nature, yeah? When Misha waits with curiosity for Jensen’s reaction to the question. They exchange glances, Jensen shrugs, it’s okay. But.
Look at the beginning of the question again. And now pay attention to the first emotion on Misha’s face. Not the one that appears when he tries to look in Jensen’s eyes. Before it. When he abruptly turns his head. Just fix your attention on it.
It’s very strange expression, isn’t it? It doesn’t look like his standard calm face, or curiosity, or joking “yeah, got it.” No. It's… strange. This was much weirder expression than his usual. I rewatched it a few times to make sure that I understood right. It’s difficult to find an interpretation for this moment from the first time, however, the more I looked, the more I realized that this emotion is directly related to Misha’s opinion on this matter. Not just this emotion, this whole moment.
I discussed this point several times with my lovely @astrariia and we both agreed on a few things. In order to see this, you need to slow down the frame. Misha’s lips are pursed and his jaw is clenched. As if he understands that something not very pleasant will happen now. And not from a fan’s side, but from Jensen’s side, because Misha is looking at Jensen. What is this emotion?
Light irritation. This is the only phrase I could come up with. It immediately develops into their mutual exchange of glances, after which Jensen shrugs, and Misha has a different facial expression (crooked grin). Everything happens in less than a minute, but you can see it.
So. Light irritation. It appeared during the question about W*lker. And that sharp turn of his head? Why didn’t he do this slowly how he did it many times before? What is this sharpness? And what’s with the expression? These questions went round and round in my head for several minutes, until I realized that this was exactly what I thought of in the first place.
What’s even more remarkable is Jensen. When Misha tilts his head, he does it on purpose to meet his eyes and see what Jensen thinks about it. The nod was a silent question. Something like “ready to answer?” Then Jensen looks up at him and shrugs like “do I have a choice?”. Then a smirk appears on Misha’s face and (again! It’s happening again!) some kind of emotion flickers, which is difficult to interpret. It’s interconnected with the first emotion, but is no longer it. It’s something else. But why did he grin crooked? Was there anything strange in fan’s question? No, it wasn’t. It’s about the topic of the question and what Jensen is going to answer.
And, as @astrariia rightly pointed out, there is an emotion like “oh, I want to watch how you will lie to them now”. Also, Jensen’s intense gaze at the fan when he realized the question is about W*lker.
I’ve always wondered what the conversations were between Jensen and Misha because of this show, were they arguing or not. I don’t know. But, perhaps, these seconds answered my question.
Follow this silently emotion’s sharing which they will never tell us about. Light irritation. Nod. Jensen shrugs like he’s making excuses. Misha’s smirk. Question keeps going, as if nothing had happened.
And this wordless exchange of something, clearly not intended for our ears, made me think that yes. Yes, W*lker was the reason for their conversations. And yes, he was probably their stumbling block. Jensen looks like he understands what Misha tries to say, but since he still has to answer the question, so now he can only shrug and to convey wordless something like “I signed up for this myself”.
I can’t say how does Misha generally feel about the fact that, for example, Jensen played a character (as far as I know) in love with a girl named Cassie. Although W*lker has nothing to do with the SPN, and making such a reference to Destiel is simply disgusting of them.
Whatever the case, Misha knows how Jensen feels about certain things and knows that he’ll have to lie to the fans because he can’t tell the truth. And that’s what his smirk seemed to mean.
We still have a lot of unclear points. But this convention convinced me of this completely. I don’t know about you, guys, but it’s enough for me to know that yes, there was something wrong with Jensen’s involvement in this from the beginning. Misha (probably) initially didn’t approve of this, knowing where everything was leading. But to say what their discussions led to, unfortunately, is impossible.
For my money, I will fully agree that we’re seeing a perfect example of how close Jensen and Misha are, here - because they literally carry on an entire conversation with each other just with looks and not a single word exchanged. BUT, they both still fully understand what the other is saying. Though, imo, the tenor and content of the conversation is a bit different.
When Misha hears the W*nker question, he does purse his lips and his head immediately whips around so he can look at Jensen and see his reaction. I don’t see irritation, here, though. This, I think, is more concern for Jensen than anything else - sort of a knee-jerk ‘uh-oh, this again’ reaction - but he takes another second and studies Jensen’s face and tips his head to the side, trying to get his attention (but also trying to read Jensen and see what’s going on in his head in the moment).
Jensen looks over at him and Misha gives him a questioning look, almost like, 'should I come to your rescue and interrupt you at some point, so you don’t have to spend too much time on this?’, but Jensen just shrugs, like - nah, this is fine, I figured somebody might ask, so might as well get it out of the way.
Misha interprets this look from Jensen and smiles a little, amused, like 'okay, so long as you’re sure’ and returns his attention to the asker. Jensen nods and keeps nodding at him to confirm and reassure him - this is okay, I’m okay, we can keep going.
The thing is - Jensen and Misha are on one side, in counter to Jerd, in this instance. Even though J3rd dragged Jensen onto W*nker to direct by leaning on the 'help your brother out, man’ bullshit (you just know he did), Misha is Jensen’s best friend and they always, ALWAYS have each other’s backs. Jensen will do his best to support Misha however he can and Misha always does the same with him. So you know that they’ve had at least one (but probably MANY) conversations where Jensen has been tearing his hair out over this mess and Misha’s tried to be supportive, but he knows Jensen’s not interested in getting all tangled up in that show or anything to do with it.
Originally, J3rd wanted Jensen to PLAY Walker himself, but Jensen backed away from the idea, and so J3rd became Walker instead. And it just went on that way for a while - J3rd whittling down his expectations/assumptions/demands of Jensen starring in the thing to getting him to direct and then, because J3rd just doesn’t know when to quit, getting him to play an as-yet uncast character (when, originally - and Jensen said it himself during this con - the W*nker people were like 'oh, you want to PLAY this character’ and Jensen was like 'ah-ah, I didn’t say that’ - so they tried, yet again, to wrangle him into a full-on recurring role on the show!)
And for Jensen - this guy who has tried so hard to get away from J3rd and everything he represents in the last couple of years, to the point of even starting his own production company with a specific emphasis on LGBTQ+ representation - I can’t even imagine how frustrating and demoralizing it can be to get dragged back into this person’s orbit, when he’s just so very done with him and everything he’s about.
So yeah, that’s my take - Misha will always have Jensen’s back about this issue, but it’s obvious they’ve had many a conversation about it. It’s very much a point of contention - not between them, but between them as a couple (best friends, husbands, however you want to interpret it) against J3rd.
Misha’s the one who’s had to hear all about it from Jensen, so he knows it’s a touchy subject for him - at least, when they’re alone talking - but when he checks in with him, Jensen confirms that he’s fine to talk about it (since he already had at other points during that weekend, anyway).
There’s so much more stuff like this - Misha saying “myconfession” and Jensen pointing out that he could see Misha peeking out during Cas’s confession - but that’s how this particular little silent conversation read to me, anyway.
I honestly don’t know what the fuck happened this weekend - or why - but I do know that a lot of people had their feelings hurt by what took place.
I know Misha turned right back around and said ‘I’m straight’ two days later, but something just feels off about all of this and it’s bothering me to fractal degrees. I think Misha might have gotten a look at the backlash and the hate (which he already got anyway, well before this whole thing even happened) and felt like he had to backpedal.
Either that, or (equally, if not much more likely, imo) the hellnetwork was like 'yeahhhhh, nah - you wanna keep playing Harvey Dent, you take that shit back immediately.’ Because it fits their silencing MO down to the fucking ground.
All I know is, Misha leaves comments like the above on Jensen’s stuff frequently and there are just sheaves and sheaves of other examples that I could point out between them over the years.
I honestly don’t know if there’s such a thing as a guy who’s so supportive of the LGBTQ+ community that he accidentally/mistakenly comes out as queer, himself, but it feels like a turned-inside-out reboot of the movie In & Out and… I’m just perplexed.
Another thing I know is - I don’t think Misha would ever do something, intentionally, to hurt us. A lot of people are hurt, and that’s fair enough, but I do think we need to leave room for grace and forgiveness for Misha as well. NONE OF US know what he’s contending with professionally or personally right now - not all of it - and so to lash out at him when we genuinely don’t know everything that’s going on (and most likely never will) is… short-sighted, I feel.
If it was Jerd, I could fullyunderstand the whip-crack fast angry responses from the fans - because he has a history of putting his foot in his mouth up to the thigh when it comes to the subject of queers and queerness. But Misha has been a solid and stalwart supporter of the fans - fans of ALL STRIPES, from every community - almost as soon as he realized the well of resources he found in us. He said, I want to do more with my celebrity than just having people kiss my butt all day - I want this to do real work for people who need it.
I understand people are hurt, but please take into account his history with the fandom and the LGBTQ+ community before you judge him too harshly. Yes, he absolutely did fuck up, here - BUT - of any person in the cast who might have earned the benefit of doubt, it’s Misha.
This community can’t afford to throw away invaluable and outspoken allies like him for a clumsily worded joke (which, btw - someone in the audience made a bi joke themselves about all poets being bi, so it’s not like it can’t be joked about ever – but I think Misha just rolled with the joke a bit too far, let’s say?).
I don’t think he was making bi people the butt of any joke - I think he was just riffing on a remark that was floating around during the panel and it just went pear-shaped on him.
It’s a public event, entirely unscripted and extemporaneous, and he put his foot in it. It happens.
I get the hurt, I truly do, but please again consider - if Misha is actually not straight and the network literally just made him go back into the closet, right in front of us, amidst a dogpile of hateful tinhats calling him a fake bisexual just coming out to make money… just take a second and please imagine what that feels like.
There are just too many unknown variables potentially at work behind the scenes for us to make sweeping declarations of betrayal or deceit, here.
Here’s outtakes from the “Roriel” photo shoot, lol. I had to pick the one where he looked serious for the main photo since Castiel always has that kind of “blank face”.
Rory’s Castiel costume, pretty much finished. Just have to tweak the mechanical issues, like how to get the wings on, lol. I hand sewed it so the stitching is a mess, but I had fun making it.
(The photo makes it look like it’s all jumbled, but it’s just not sitting right and I have to iron it.) Post link
Rory’s costume is getting there. Now I just have to train him to say “It’s funnier in Enochian”
(I don’t do this often. I’m not a “dress up my dog” person, every few years I just get this thing to challenge myself with a dog costume since I don’t know how to sew. It also usually has to be fandom/geek-related. Plus, previously Blitzen became semi-internet famous with the Doctor Who/Eleven costume that I made him, so we’ll see if Rory’s costume is an internet hit.) :)
I love how powerful Michael is. Like, he is terrifyingly powerful. He killed Lilith with a snap of his fingers. He opened a portal to Purgatory WHILE he was wearing powersuppressing handcuffs. He should not have been able to do that, though. Michael from world 2 couldn’t use his powers when he was cuffed, so how could our Michael? Is he just that powerful? But why didn’t he just, escape? Like, he can open a portal to Purgatory, but he can’t open the handcuffs? Or teleport/fly away? I’m a little confused.
How do angel powers work?
Do I know?
Do you know?
Do the writers know?
But, also, I actually don’t really care. Because it’s just so awesome.
(Side note: will Cass become more powerful, now that Michael is free? With the whole “the more angels there are, the more powerful the angels are” thing? Or does Michael specifically need to be in Heaven for that to work?)
