#theism
Can you make your theism work without:
1. Positing that there are a set of qualities that one person/a group of beings/ people can have that render them categorically entitled to another’s service (in other words, can you function as a theist with a reason to worship the gods other than that they inherently deserve it for belonging to ‘god’ category, IE, the circumstances of their birth)
2. The notion that “might makes right,”
3. Authoritarian structures in your thinking,
4. The idea of divine punishment, ie, ‘obey or else you’ll get it,’
4. Capitalist notions that put piety in easier reach of the rich than the poor,
at least in your personal practice?
Can you, in short, deconstruct your practice and find all of the things that resonate with our present authoritarian, omnicidal, capitalist hell scape and put your practice back together without them?
Can you remove ‘because they are gods and that’s that’ or ‘because the gods said so and we don’t question authority that big’ or ‘if you are too tired and poor to do a more elaborate and expensive rite, you can’t expect the gods to answer’ from your practice?
Why or why not?
What would it look like if you did?
What would the consequences be in terms of socializing with other religious people? Would there be other consequences?
RB with your answers.
Suffice it to say that, as a queer ex-Christian, I have a lot of thoughts on this topic. I don’t normally talk about my religious experiences on here, but these sorts of questions heavily inform how I write Heralds of Rhimn so I figure it’s relevant to discuss.
“Then you do it because I am a higher power,” the goddess stated simply. “You are the flesh of my soul. I gave you your second birth. I brought you back from death. Without me, you would not even be alive to slander my name. It is your duty to raise yourself up in my eyes. And currently, you are trying my patience.”
Navaeli shook her head. Her voice shook too. “No. Give me a real reason.”
So, why worship the gods if their authority isn’t a driving factor? If they aren’t deserving of it for being powerful, or more-than-mortal?
That’s a question any theist will have to answer for themself, but for me, a good answer to all of these questions ties in with the concept of praxis. Communing with the gods helps me get in touch with my desires and translate ideas into action.
I seek agency, so I travel with Hermes. I seek stability, so I shelter with Hestia. I seek creativity and bravery, so I write with the Muses and with Aries.
A lot of people think that a relationship with the divine involves some cowering, and frankly, that’s why I left Christianity; too much time spent making sure I wasn’t offensive to God just by existing the wrong way (coughcoughlesbiancoughcough).
It’s no way to live, and it’s a fear I’ve taken pains to strip from my current practices. Mostly with help from Hestia.
Honestly? If you know how to treat regular human beings with respect, you’re likely to treat the gods with a suitable amount of respect too. So many stories in Greek mythology center around gods punishing mortals for their hubris, but tell me, if some asshole went around bragging that they were much better and smarter than you, wouldn’t you have the impulse to give them a pratfall too? My general takeaway here is the ever-helpful “try not to be a dick.”
I’ve fucked up a few times, but I wasn’t smote or injured or otherwise harmed. The situation resolved itself the way most relationship hiccoughs do, with an apology and some reflection.
(I’m pretty socially awkward, honestly, and working things out with the gods has helped me work things out with people.)
As for offerings … I feel that what matters more than the quality or quantity of what you can offer is the intent behind it. I have thrifted candles for Hestia, and I treat my computer as a sort of hearth, and I devote the time I take to improve my living space to her. Hermes has a container of strange coins I’ve picked up off the ground, and my time spent traveling on the bus is a good time to pray if I want. Aries and the Muses have a cup of pens I use for personal projects. If you understand your reasoning, then whatever you have is good enough.
And these are all principles I put into practice when I write Heralds of Rhimn. I try to keep in mind what the people making the offerings have access to. A noble priest of Gardhe can afford to lay fine jewelry on their alter; a feyrie child might give the Romne part of their cookie.
The latter is not a lesser offering.
Wisdom from Claude Bernard:
It is what we know already that often prevents us from learning.
The experimenter who does not know what he is looking for will not understand what he finds.
When we meet a fact which contradicts a prevailing theory, we must accept the fact and abandon the theory, even when the theory is supported by great names and generally accepted.
Man can learn nothing unless he proceeds from the known to the unknown.
All the vital mechanisms, varied as they are, have only one object, that of preserving constant the conditions of life in the internal environment.
We achieve more than we know. We know more than we understand. We understand more than we can explain.
Those who do not know the torment of the unknown cannot have the joy of discovery.
Men who have excessive faith in their theories or ideas are not only ill prepared for making discoveries; they also make very poor observations. Of necessity, they observe with a preconceived idea, and when they devise an experiment, they can see, in its results,only a confirmation of their theory. In this way they distort observation and often neglect very important facts because they do not further their aim.
We must keep our freedom of mind, … and must believe that in nature what is absurd, according to our theories, is not always impossible.
The science of life is a superb and dazzlingly lighted hall which may be reached only by passing through a long and ghastly kitchen.
Mediocre men often have the most acquired knowledge.
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Random Fact #3,604
The 2011 Australian census shows that rates of reporting no religion increase with higher educational qualifications.
Note:That doesn’t mean that atheists are necessarily smarter than theists (intelligence has nothing to do with one’s level of education, after all). It does, however, suggest that as one’s level of understanding of how the world works increases the likelihood of belief in the supernatural decreases.
I was once asked why I don’t find the bible to be a trustworthy source of information. When discussing theism I nearly immediately dismiss Bible quotes when they are used as ‘evidence’ in support of a position. In response, I wrote the following:
Let’s assume for a second that each reader of the bible has a perfect understanding of the words they read. There’s no miscommunication what so ever between the text of each page and the reader’s mind. Nothing is taken out of context and all of the passages that are metaphors are rightly understood to be so, and all of the literal parts are correctly understood to be literal.
That’s not likely, but let’s give the Christian the benefit of the doubt and assume a perfect understanding of the texts.
Well, we know that the Bible was compiled from multiple sources. Let’s assume that *before* the reshuffling, the Bible was wrong, and *after* the reshuffling it was corrected to the perfect intent of the word of God. Let’s assume there were no political motivations for the compilations or what was left out or added into the bible.
That’s not likely, but let’s give the bible the benefit of the doubt and assume a perfect compilation of the texts.
Well, we also know that the Bible was not written in English, that various sections were translated from Aramaic, Hebrew, and Greek to Latin and then into English. Let’s assume that the people doing the translations got the translations perfectly.
That’s not likely, but let’s give the translators the benefit of the doubt and assume a perfect translation of the texts.
Well, we also know that the New Testament spent anywhere from 70-300 (For the New Testament, thousands for the Old Testament) years passed down orally. Let’s assume that each oral record keeper remembered every single line and parable exactly correctly, without a *single* memory lapse.
That’s not likely, but let’s give the record keepers the benefit of the doubt and assume a perfect recall of what they’ve heard.
Well, there still was the first eye witness testimony. The person who saw each event in the first person, and relayed it to the first Oral record keeper. Given what we know about eye witness testimony being completely unreliable, let’s still assume that every eye witness of every event in the new testament perfectly saw each event. None were drunk, none had dust in their eyes. None exaggerated or fell to confirmation bias. Each event was during perfect weather with great visibility.
That’s not likely, but let’s give every witness the benefit of the doubt and assume they had perfect perception of the events they saw.
Well, there still was the initial event those eye witnesses saw. Let’s assume that none of the involved parties engaged in any slight of hand. There was no deception or delusion, no ill intent or narcotics. Each person involved was completely genuine and earnest in their role. There were no political power plays, none fell into the normal mental lapses caused by joining cults with charismatic leaders.
That’s not likely, but let’s give Jesus/The Apostles the benefit of the doubt and assumed that everything they said/did was 100% earnest and accurate.
So to surmise, let’s assume we have a perfectly understood, perfectly compiled, perfectly translated, perfectly remembered and told orally, perfectly witnessed events by genuine folks that would never lie to gain power over their peers.
We STILL are left with events that could have natural causes that weren’t seen or understood at the time due to a lack of education. Even something as unlikely as aliens interfering with ancient civilizations, time traveling humans, or just extremely unlikely coincidences.
But in reality, NONE of the things above are likely to be true, and as such we are left with a book that few understand, compiled by people who may have had a political agenda, translated by people who may have added their own interpretation, written down be people who may not have understood oral historians, who may have misremembered events that may have happened differently than eyewitnesses remembered that were driven by people who may have been deceptive around events they may not have understood.
This, in my opinion, lands the trustworthiness of the bible at approximately zero.
noitemsfoxonlyfinaldestination:
Common Creationist Misconceptions No. 25-32.
nah fam the “animal” argument is kind of subjective and altogether not even that related to theism
ability to appreciate art and high-level thinking separates us from animals
humans not being animals doesn’t make god or any other deities real, however
we’re all here on this mud ball by chance
Humans are animals. Calling it “subjective” and trying to pass it off as some kind of pseudo-intellectual philosophical bullshit because you don’t like it is dishonest and scientifically ignorant. It’s not “agree to disagree” any more than gravity or electricity is “agree to disagree”: you either accept it or you’re wrong. Because smarter people than you (and i) figured it out, mapped it out in comprehensive detail across DNA, chromosomes and genes, proteins, biological morphology and more, across hundreds of years, in books and volumes and studies and data. More so than your less-than-cogent:
nah fam
Denial will not help you.
We are a species of animal. The science - the biology, the genetics, the anthropology, the chemistry - proves it. If you’re that insecure about recognizing you are a form of animal - distinct, but still an animal - then that’s a problem you need to work on yourself in regards to your ability to deal with reality, and your belief that your feelings constitute it. For Quetzalcoatl’s sake, why on Earth do you think animal lab test animals have been a thing for decades (and more recently, protests about them)?
ability to appreciate art and high-level thinking separates us from animals
Firstly, “high-level” actually is subjective, and all you did is name things that you value. Cite me a paper that lists those as objective criteria for separating animals from…. whatever the hell you think we are. They separate us only from other species and are in no way evidence we are not animals. You can’t fly. You can’t lay eggs, you can’t kill an antelope with your jaws. There’s literally thousands of things you can’t do that other species can. See well in the dark. Breathe underwater. Regrow a limb. Run at 60mph. Build a honeycomb. Communicate underwater over long distances with high-frequency whistle sounds.
BTW:
- https://io9.gizmodo.com/this-is-what-it-looks-like-when-chimpanzees-create-art-1236945444
- http://langint.pri.kyoto-u.ac.jp/ai/en/album/the_drawings_by_chimpanzees.html
- https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2013/aug/30/chimpanzee-wins-10000-dollars-abstract-painting
- https://mashable.com/2017/11/05/painting-dolphins/
- https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/lithuania/1495710/Dolphin-paintings–the-latest-in-abstract-art.html
- https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/06/150625112010.htm
- https://www.cnn.com/2013/01/19/health/chimpanzee-fairness-morality/index.html
- http://www.earthisland.org/journal/index.php/articles/entry/chimps_and_bonobos_prove_that_moral_behavior_is_a_product_of_evolution/
- https://www.livescience.com/24802-animals-have-morals-book.html
And I wouldn’t brag about “high-level thinking” in the first place if you’re unable to accept well-established, well-documented facts and instead operate solely on your instincts. You’re pretty much disproving your own point.
We are not all here by chance. We are here because millions of small changes have added up over millions of years, and we are the result of being on the successful branch of that line. More species than exist today have already died out because their propagation was less successful than ours. We carried and propagated traits that worked in our advantage. Just as occurred for all the other thousands of species that exist today.
Fucking deal with it, because in spite of how pseudo-”enlightened” and “intellectual” you try to cast it, this sort of claptrap, almost daring to dip its tip into the cavity of “souls” or “spiritual,” is as stupid, regressive and evidence-free as theist bullshit.
This is the best retort to bullshit I have ever seen. Like if there were Oscars given for calling out someone’s bullshit this would win!!
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People in Islam (Special Edition): Khadijah, the wife of Muhammad.
As I try to collect my thought on Khadijah, one of the four most pious women on the face of existence, I realize that we have done much injustice to this great of a personality. A thriving character who has been an utmost inspiration and motivation for our beloved and holy Prophet Muhammad, Khadijah is regarded as a master mind of intellect and spirituality. As we observe her many sacrifices for the religion of Islam, we realize that she is one of the best, if not the best, heroes of our time.
Born from one of the most highly regarded clans in Arabia, Khadijah inherited her father’s business talents and vast wealth after his death in 585. While travelling along with her caravans in places in Arabia and parts of Syria and Yemen, a man of great character stood on the sideline to observe her talents, seeking for a job. This man was Muhammad.
Because of her outstanding character and bravery, Khadijah was regarded as Khadijah the Great, Princess of Quraish, and The Pure One. Sources even suggest that Khadijah neither believed in nor worshipped idols; she used to feed and clothe the poor while assisting relatives and friends with disabling financial situations. And because of this, Muhammad adored her.
And within a few years of working for Khadijah (aha! Please note the sunnah of Muhammad in this instance, where working for a woman was not problematic, even during the times of Ignorance), Muhammad realized that Khadijah was an impeccable woman whom he loved with utmost certainty. Hence, they soon married.
After being Muhammad’s supporter, mentor, female best friend, lover, adviser, and genuine companion, she was the mother of Fatima, the first daughter of Muhammad who was named after Khadijah’s own mother. She was the mother of Fatima, the grandmother of the two chiefs of Paradise, Hassan and Hussain, the first and most beloved wife of Muhammad, and the main supporter of the religion of Islam.
And when death greeted her, Muhammad mourned her for years to come, praising her to all of his wives about her steadfastness and beautiful personality that none of them together could have ever encompassed.
Assalama Alayka ya Khadijah tu Kubra, Ameerat Quraish, wa Al Tahira al Mathlooma.
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People in Islam: Sheikh Abdal-Hakim Murad – Teacher, Professor, Scholar, and Author
It’s unfortunate that I’ve listened to this brother’s lectures and seen him appear on several documentaries and have failed to grasp and remember his name. Alhamdulilah, with the help of several suggestions, I’ve come to understand who Sheikh Murad is and be able to to more research so that we can describe his level of expertise and intellect at a just level.
Brother Abdal-Hakim Murad, the Dean of the Cambridge Muslim College in the UK, was voted most influential British Muslim thinker by Jordan’s Royal Strategic Islamic Studies Center. He translated a number of Islamic texts in English, like some of Imam Ghazali’s work, which is extremely important for our students right now who aren’t as well learnt in Arabic as he is.
Also, Brother Murad studies and gives lectures at a number of places, included Singapore, Australia, Spain, and Malaysia. In his spare time, Murad writes a number of books. In fact, His most recent book is Commentary on the Eleventh Contentions (which he just recently published).
If you’re further interested in Cambridge Muslim College, watch their introductory Youtube video here. To read more about Brother Murad, read a lengthy description here. For one of his lectures on Crisis of Modern Consciousness (the Q&A session), listen to this. To like his fanpage on Facebook, click here.
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Ugh I hate atheists who are like “believing in the big magical SkyDaddy™ makes you stupid which is why all religion is lame and full of idiots” like shut up. shut the fuck up. Please go burn whatever neo-Rationalist bullshit you’ve been consuming and go read Durkheim or any other basic text on the sociology of religion. Get some nuanced understanding of how religion works and why people believe in the metaphysical. Stop using atheism as an excuse to be an asshole to people who practice a religion. Fuck you.
If you use Rationalist anti-theism to be an asshole to theists, you’re basically doing the same thing to them as Christians who are assholes to non-Christians do to you. Also, stop going “Christianity is bad therefore all religions are bad” you absolute dunderhead.
the linguistic shift from “avatar” or “icon” to “pfp” is bad actually. bring back the implications of ritual significance. cowards.
“Praying to god is flattering one self into thinking that with words we can change all of nature.”
– Voltaire
The ineffectiveness of prayer is matched only by its breathtaking narcissism.
HUNDREDS OF REASONS NOT TO BE RELIGIOUS!
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